are we a free nation anymore?

Discuss the latest news in the media and voice your own opinions about the news.

are we a free nation anymore?

Postby steve » Fri Aug 10, 2007 8:35 pm

i was reading in the paper on tuesday that the home office are going to force people who have committed offences such as dropping litter or smoking to surrender their dna. this is just the latest in a long list of freedoms that have been eroded since new labour came to power. i wonder if anyone read the book "taking liberties" by chris atkins which details this.
of course there's the introduction of i.d. cards. and the power of the state to imprison foreign nationals without trial (incompatible accoding to human rights groups because it violates both the right to liberty and the right to a fair trial). former home secretary john reid is an ex-stalinist so his attitude towards civil liberties is understandable. but i'm wondering if hariet harman is any different. our friends across the atlantic are also dealing with these problems. hundreds of american and international muslims have been taken without trial to a detention camp which is authorised to use torture. and then there's the "patriot act" which allows the government to spy on their citizen's activities online over the phone, have access to their medical records etc. i'm all for confronting the terrorist threat but I have to ask the question: have we gone too far?
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Postby eastlondonluke » Fri Aug 10, 2007 10:13 pm

Theres cctv every where but dats just to try to protect us but ders so many terorist threts out there and cause these things keep going on the high leval of sercurity gos up but yeh when ya heir about these things on the news and in da paper it dos make you think that every thing ya do will be whatched by a load of high sercurity peeps
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Postby steve » Fri Aug 10, 2007 10:19 pm

i'm just afraid of what this is going to lead to. the government tell us that it's necessary to restrict our freedoms temporarily in order to fight the "war on terrorism". but how can you win a war like that? when you elimanate one terrorist group there's always the chance that annother one can be created. we're trying to put an end to something so widespread it's just plain impossible. so when will we get our freedoms back? and if there's another attack (which there is likely to be), will we lose more?
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Postby eastlondonluke » Fri Aug 10, 2007 10:29 pm

I dont realy no all i no is this generation geting wores belive me iv seen it all growing up in the east end but life gos on i guess and you move away or move on from things not every one dos but i did and it help i no its hard to look for the posertive side of things in life but ya no sometimes you do lol
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Postby steve » Fri Aug 10, 2007 10:37 pm

that's a good attitude to have
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Postby eastlondonluke » Fri Aug 10, 2007 10:55 pm

Wow thanks mate
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Postby steve » Fri Aug 10, 2007 10:56 pm

no problem
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Postby eastlondonluke » Fri Aug 10, 2007 10:59 pm

Cooooooooooooool atleast some one is thinking in sum what the same as me lol 8) 8) 8) 8)
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Postby intowiz » Fri Aug 10, 2007 11:45 pm

i must agree with luke atleast theres someone else on here with the belief that we live in a dystopian state. i find it terrible that we have no privacy and any privacy we had weve given away for the supposed feeling of sfety from apparent terrorists.
unfortunatly the goverment, THE SCUM OF THE LABOUR PARTY have taken away are liberties one by one soon we will have to show id cards to s members SHOUTING HALT VERE IS YOUR IDENTIFICATION. it makes me physically sick that we just let them do it without protest. centuries ago we would have beheaded people for such things. i say all people of britain should finnaly rise up and say no. no more we want our freedoms back we want our rights as human beings back. we shouldnt just stand back and let them all the while saying oh well its to protect us. from who ourselves!!!! no to protect them from us. the police acting as there puppet bodygaurds and our right to protest (one of our basic rights) taken away to keep us silenced.

"The world should apply what Natan Sharansky calls the "town square test": if a person cannot walk into the middle of the town square and express his or her views without fear of arrest, imprisonment, or physical harm, then that person is living in a fear society, not a free society."

Benjamin Franklin once said "they who would give up an essential liberty for temporary security , deserve neither liberty or security."

and i completely agree if your weak enough to give up yours and others rights and liberties as a human being because your scared (most of the time by the goverment and the media the people who afre meant to protect us) then you do not deserve freedom.
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Postby eastlondonluke » Sat Aug 11, 2007 11:45 am

Yeh this dam nation would be beter f it was like that but sadley its not and thats just crap and it ant gona get beter at all there to many dodgy peeps out der so da cctv has to be in place,whish things could be diffrent
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Postby steve » Sat Aug 11, 2007 2:59 pm

cctv is probably necessary (although we could do with a little less of it). i think the problem is that the people who are prepared to surrender their freedoms do so because they are convinced that we are safe just because we live in a democracy. wrong! if you give a government the power to worm its way into your private life, chances are it will abuse that power. anybody who thinks that their government is completely trustworthy and in no way corrupt is living in a fairytale world. the reason the concept of civil liberties was devised in the first place is to prevent such abuses.
intowiz is right, we need to act and fast. maybe we could have a riot, like the one 15 years ago when margaret thatcher tried to intruduce a poll tax. that would send a message!
Last edited by steve on Sat Aug 11, 2007 9:31 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby eastlondonluke » Sat Aug 11, 2007 9:03 pm

Where i come from theres a lot of crime going on and evern though i don't live there any more i no what sort of stuff gos on there and allso alot of stuff that has gon on there.

Theres not realy many places in the country i no of where isent much crime and lets face it if there was verey low crime we wouldent need cctv that much but i do think it helps alot cause it helps catch criminals farster and maks it easyer for the feds {police] to catch them.

I see what you mean about it though about privicy but it does need to be there though for our own safety
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Postby steve » Sat Aug 11, 2007 9:06 pm

i heard recently they invented a new kind of cctv camera through which the police can shout orders at people they see breaking laws. now that IS creepy! maybe an alternative to constant surveillance would be to get the police back on the beat like they used to do. although criminals are much more dangerous nowadays so i don't know if it'll work.
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Postby eastlondonluke » Sat Aug 11, 2007 9:29 pm

We need more feeds on the beat these days
Last edited by eastlondonluke on Sat Aug 11, 2007 9:35 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby steve » Sat Aug 11, 2007 9:33 pm

but you just said there was alot of crime. why don't we need them?
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