Austistic spectrum

Share any tips or ideas that you have which make living with dyspraxia easier.(Please start a new thread for each tip)

Austistic spectrum

Postby rita » Wed May 10, 2006 2:21 pm

What exatly is under this umbrella ?

What are the similarities between Dyspraxia, Asperger's, Autism?

Do they all overlap simultaneously?

Can someone be dyspraxic, autistic, and have asperger's all at once?

Anyone here in this situation?
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Postby parnassus » Wed May 10, 2006 3:47 pm

Asperger's Syndrome and autism are not two different things. Saying autism is like saying Europe. Saying Asperger's is like saying Spain. AS is a specific subtype of autism - an autistic spectrum disorder. So while a person with AS is able to say, "I am autistic," in the same way I am able to say, "I am European," the person who diagnosed him would not write on his report, "X has autism and Asperger's." That would be like me saying, "I am European and English." It's unnecessary.

The majority of people with AS have co-ordination difficulties. Significant motor clumsiness is given as a symptom in Gillberg's Diagnostic Criteria for Asperger's Disorder. But while most people with AS have dyspraxia, not all people with dyspraxia have AS.

Dyspraxia is not classed as an autistic spectrum disorder in its own right. I heard Dr Fiona Scott and Simon Baron-Cohen lecturing on this when I went on a psychology course with NAGTY. They say there is a link between the autistic spectrum and the specific learning difficulties - it's something they're researching at Cambridge right now. But high levels of comorbidity do not necessarily mean that the disorders are of the same essence. Personally, I have many autistic traits and the various professionals in my life have debated long and hard on what precise label to give me. These have swung from PDD-NOS to NVLD to hyperlexia. It is sometimes hard to know exactly what you're dealing with.

Here is the 'official' autistic spectrum according to Dr Scott.

Autistic Disorder
Asperger's Syndrome
Heller's Syndrome (also known as Childhood Disintegrative Disorder)
Rhett's Syndrome (a neurodegenerative disorder that only affects girls)
Pervasive Developmental Disorder Not Otherwise Specified (PDD-NOS)


There are only five official types of autism. By 'official', I mean listed in the DSM as a pervasive developmental disorder. But Semantic-Pragmatic Disorder, Non-Verbal Learning Disability (NVLD), and some others are recognised unofficially. The following site has excellent information:

http://www.pediatricneurology.com/autis ... 0Disorders
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Postby rita » Wed May 10, 2006 3:49 pm

thanks heaps! that was very informative!!! :)
Last edited by rita on Wed May 10, 2006 4:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby invisifish » Wed May 10, 2006 6:35 pm

i suspect myself of having asberger syndrome, the more i hear about it the more i think i have it, or somthing like it.
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Postby invisifish » Wed May 10, 2006 6:54 pm

is it a dyspraxic symptom to have rootins that are unbreacable, even if i wanted to?
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Postby parnassus » Wed May 10, 2006 8:43 pm

No.

Most dyspraxic people enjoy routine - it helps you to remember things more easily if you follow a strict pattern - but very few of us are so entrenched in routines that we cannot break them.

If your love of routine is so intense that it interferes with your daily life, then you could have AS or else Obsessive-Compulsive Disorder. OCD is not on the autistic spectrum. It is a psychological problem. You are not born with OCD; it develops over time. Has your need for routine always been present or can you pinpoint a moment in time when it began to develop?

In another message you wrote that you were diagnosed with dyspraxia only recently. Most educational psychologists typically probe for Asperger's when they take the case history and interview your special teacher. I think it would have been picked up by now if you had a full-blown autistic spectrum disorder, but there is always a chance you have slipped through the net.

From what you have said about your anxiety attacks and phobias, I think OCD is the more likely possibility. But I'm not a psychologist, so I wouldn't know for sure. I think you should talk to someone about this. * Virtual hugs *
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Postby Thirteen-thirty-seven » Thu May 11, 2006 9:16 am

Invisifish, Vicky is right. Your ed. psych would probably have noticed Asperger's syndrome. Your love of routine could be part of dyspraxia, or it could be OCD. I don't know how strong it is, so I don't know if it's a problem. But you seem to have been quite stressed and unhappy for a while. *Hugs*
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Postby invisifish » Thu May 11, 2006 5:44 pm

when i got diognosed with dyspraxia, the people doing the test did not do a full test, they were not checking for anything other than what tipe of school would be good for me, they did not check my cordination of my balance, they dident ask questions about my obsetions, habits or anithing els. they checked my hand writing, my spelling, my reading and math. the only other thing i remeber them testing on is dooing puzzels.

i have always needed rootin, and i dislike going on holiday. my mum says that i have always needed to know what was going to hapen next, i have always needed a plan for everything and im the most obsesive person i know and the most anxios. from when i was 5 until i was 8 i was obsesed with the planets, the solar system and space in genral. i read anithing about space i could get my hands on, i read the paper about space probes and stufe like that. when i was 7 i remeber being in class and the teacher, knowing that i was obsesed with space and the planets asked me to anser questions that she dident know the anser to and i wrote an esay on the solar system(i dident actualy write it, i recorded what i wanted to say so the teacher could write it.
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Postby Thirteen-thirty-seven » Fri May 12, 2006 8:52 am

You sound like you are somewhere on the autistic spectrum, but it could just be part of severe dyspraxia.
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Postby invisifish » Sat May 13, 2006 6:38 pm

i have very mield dyspraxia.
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Postby Joss1991 » Sat May 13, 2006 7:02 pm

im the same as invishfish i have mild dyspraxic but i have 2 have the same rutine and i get obsessed by things
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Postby Hermionefan5 » Mon May 15, 2006 5:50 pm

I've been diagnosed with NVLD:

(1) Motoric integration problems: Gross motor: clumsy, unbalanced walking leading to clinging behaviors, bumping in to things, fear of climbing, hesitant to explore physically, difficulty bike-riding,
uncoordinated at sports.

All these are true for me. I have had trouble in the past with bikeriding, but have gotten better. The same happened with sports. I don't usually bump into stuff, but sometimes. I have some unbalanced walking and I do have trouble with certain sports like gymnastics. Although I can play soccer (as I practiced for 9 years) and basketball and baseball okay.

Fine motor: using scissors, shoe tying (which she’ll talk herself through), poor handwriting using awkward and tight grip, finger agnosia.

Used to have much trouble with shoe tying and handwriting, but have gotten better. Handwriting still a bit messy though. Finger agnosia, yes. Had to have a gripper on my pencil for a long time...

(2) Visual-Spatial-Orientation integration problems, with inability to form visual images: Resultant focus on detail rather than the important gestalt. This is what I have most problems with.

Labels everything verbally, since that is the only—albeit not always accurate—way she can process the visual/spatial information. For example, she may find her way home by counting houses and labeling landmarks verbally.

This helps me a lot.

Unaware where she is in space, so unaware of where to place answers on the homework sheet, or how to navigate the school.
These elaborate “naming” strategies break down with changes in routine, leading to an inability to cope with change.

Um, yup. I have much trouble with this! But still working hard to better it!

(3) Social/communication problems: Trouble integrating non-verbal communication with verbal communication to achieve full social interaction.
The children do clearly appear to want social acceptance (vs. Asperger’s, where the children do not usually appear interested socially).
However, typically labeled as “annoying” because of their dependence on others, their constant speech, and their misinterpretation of social cues.
Very literal interpretation of others; concrete thinking; seeing the world in black and white; trouble understanding dishonesty; trouble seeing hidden meanings, prompting others to say “You know what I meant!”—when they didn’t.
Don’t read the social cues of give and take conversation, thus appearing self-centered, weird, or impolite.

Yup, this has happened to me quite often in my life. I have gotten a bit better at social cues, but still I find that people percieve me as annoying or selfish when I'M CLEARLY NOT THAT WAY!! :x


NVLD symptoms change through the lifespan:

Symptoms as toddlers: Uncoordinated (gross motor and fine motor).
Trouble with social interactions, non-verbal clues (such as a peer’s facial expression of “Enough is enough!”), and adjustments to change. They may appear “confused.”
Warning signal: You always have to tell the child, “I shouldn’t have to tell you that.” Obviously, with these kids, you do have to tell them. That’s how you know there is a problem.
Trouble with spatial orientation.

Yup. Had these problems.

As a young child: Often exceptional rote speech, memory, and reading skill, which the children use to compensate for lack of intuitive social interaction. The child tries to “remember” how to interact, rather than the skill coming automatically in each different situation.
These exceptional reading and “adult” pedantic speech patterns may be interpreted as preciousness.
Clumsy monologues replace typical to-and-fro conversations.

Yeah, did this too.

Older children: Academic problems in the later elementary years with organization, inferential reading, and written output.
Math facts better than concepts.
Typically PIQ<VIQ.
Sustains focus on details, does not attend to big picture.
A life of social blunders, without ever figuring out why.
May have secondary depression or anxiety.

Yes this happened to me too. Dealt with depression and anxiety before. Had to see a psychiatrist from when I was 7 to when I was 16...until he started praying for me because he found out I liked Harry Potter, whom he apparently thought was the devil or something. :lol: My mom thought it was very unprofessional of him to pray for me in his office with me there over a thing like a book. I had mentioned I was excited for the Fantastic Beasts and Where to Find Them book and he completely FLIPPED out! I decided that I wouldn't want to mention that to a doctor ever again.
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Postby towildhoney » Wed May 17, 2006 10:46 pm

I find it difficult to come up with an appropriate distinction . I have thought of Dyspraxia as being on the Autistic Spectrum. Where do you seperate aspects of personality from a disorder is for example my being solitary part of my personality or a symptom? I have traits of autism which are probably not just personality and I'm certain notsuffering form ocd. But I'm also very capable at expresing my self verbaly. Its hard to attribute my problems solely as co-ordination learning difficulty I think my need for structure and routine go beyond the narrow definitions of dyspraxia I have seen. Yet I would not say I had AS so comorbidity is not the answer for me. I think of dyspraxia as being on the autistic spectrum with me being at the milder end of it would. Certainly when I have explained some of my problems to people they have understood it in terms of very mild autism.
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Postby towildhoney » Wed May 17, 2006 10:49 pm

Your psychiatrists behaviour would certainly disturb me and sounds both irational and grossly unprofesional. HERMIONEFAN5
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Postby meme » Thu May 18, 2006 5:39 pm

my friend has dyspraxia, dyslexia and aspergers syndrome. he is a real routine person and is almost obsessive about getting to class early and making trebly sure that we are definitely off the days we are off. Does anyone have any ways in which I could help him cos he apologises for it all the time and is constantly asking questions about our school day routine (it drives me a little mad sometimes) or is this just the way he's gonna be. Thanks in advance.
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